Follow
Share

I already talked with the director and he said he can't do anything because my mom has rights. I don't have the POA, but I am responsible for her in that nursing home. For 8 months this person has been hiding supplements to give it to her. I am worried about her health

This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
First, if you don't have POA, you are NOT responsible for your mom in her nursing facility. I'm guessing per your profile that your dad is her POA since you say he visits her everyday, and brings her food.
And secondly unless you see visible harm being done by these supposed "natural supplements" I wouldn't give them a second thought. What do you have against "natural supplements" anyway? Would you rather your mom be on high doses of prescription drugs?
I personally am all about anything that is natural and will take a supplement over a drug any day anytime!
Why don't you instead just try enjoying your visits with your mom while you can, as none of us are guaranteed tomorrow?
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
Geaton777 Jan 9, 2024
Respectfully... because once they get into your body they are chemical or element like any other that can interact with any meds she may be on. There are other reasons, too, not the least of which is supplements aren't required to prove that they actually work. Depending on what they are (like the oil-based vitamins) you can actually have a harmful adverse reaction if you take too much of it. Also, they are not monitored by the FDA so you have no idea if they are being made in someone's filthy garage, whether the dosage stated on the bottle is correct, whether the potency is accurate and whether there is consistency from pill to pill or bottle to bottle. It's called Big Supplement and they make incredible amounts of money on it because, unlike Big Pharma, one is hard pressed to be able to prove anything so there's no lawsuits or legal recourse.

If you are all for "anything that is natural", are you for arsenic? That's 100% natural. Or foxglove? That can cause heart probems. Etc.

"Any ingredient in a multiple vitamin supplement can be toxic in large amounts, but the most serious risk comes from iron or calcium. Additional risks are associated with large or toxic doses of calcium, vitamin D, and vitamin A."

Source: https://www.mountsinai.org/health-library/poison/multiple-vitamin-overdose#:~:text=Any%20ingredient%20in%20a%20multiple,vitamin%20D%2C%20and%20vitamin%20A.

I actually know someone who died from a tainted shipment of L-tryptophan (she was a contractor of ours) and the retired Pastor of my church had permanent circulatory problems in both legs from the same supplement and shipment.
(8)
Report
See 2 more replies
You have no power if you're not her PoA and if the PoA authority is active (ie your Mom now has sufficient cognitive impairment) then she gets to decide if she wants to take them or not. The only thing you can do is try to convince her to not take them or report it to her doctor.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Geaton777 Jan 9, 2024
*correction

"... if the PoA authority isn't active (ie your Mom does not have cognitive impairment) then she gets to decide if she wants to take them or not."

Even so, if she has even mild memory impairment, she shouldn't be left to make this decision.
(2)
Report
Honestly I agree that your mother cannot be deprived of friendship visits, but I DO think that you might meet with this person and have an honest discussion.
Tell this person that you understand they are trying to be helpful to your mother, and that they are well meaning, and that she appreciates their visits, as do you--but that your mother is currently on medications that can cause great harm if supplements are given that interfere with absorption and etc. and that her doctor says she should be taking NOTHING of this sort without his/her supervision.
Tell this person IN FRONT OF your mother, and a staff member if same will attend the talk, that you have no wish to prevent visits, but that if you again find any supplements given to Mom you will have to forbid visits. (pretend you CAN do so).

Tell your mother that you need agreement that you can check her room for the presence of unknown and known supplements and substances, and that they should be given to you for elimination.

If none of this works, unfortunately, and hoping you are at the least MPOA, you will need a doctor letter to the facility that ___________is visiting and is plying his/her patient with supplements that could be harmful to your mother's health, and that he is requesting this person visit ONLY accompanied to staff. Something to that effect.

I honestly cannot think, once you have done all that, what else can be done but I sure wish you luck and I sure hope this stops as supplements are NOT BENIGN and certainly CAN do harm. I hope you will update us.
Helpful Answer (7)
Report

I am surprised the director said what he did. At my Moms AL Tylenol had to be ordered by the DR. As Geaton says, natural supplements can interact with meds. I think the POA needs to tell this visitor that she is not to bring in any supplements not OKd by the doctor. I may even have one of the Nurses tell this visitor that what she is doing is dangerous. That the home needs to keep record of everything Mom takes. The State reviews these records. What if one of these supplements interacts with a med that no one is aware of it. Mom could die. After that if the visitor continues, Dad can have the visitor banned.

Are you secondary POA for Mom? If Dad can't make informed decisions pretaining to Mom anymore, maybe he should step down and allow u to invoke your POA.

My MIL had been on a blood thinner and told me that they could not get her numbers right. I knew she had been taking fish oil and had just read where it is a blood thinner. I asked her if her Dr knew she was taking it. Since I got "that look" I knew her Dr didn't know. I told her to tell her Dr the next time she saw her.
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
AlvaDeer Jan 9, 2024
I am surprised as well. We had to go through heck and high water to have my brother allowed to have even ASA in his room which he took baby one daily. No other meds. And he really was well enough mentally to do that. They really frown on medications and even supplements being found anywhere. Usually. And rightly so.
(0)
Report
Another suggestion. Ask a nurse if he/or she can ask the visitor that she needs to leave the supplement with a nurse. They will then check her med list and make sure it does not interact with any of her meds. Or give to u and u will have a nurse check the med list. This person needs to be told what she/he is doing is dangerous.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
Geaton777 Jan 9, 2024
If the LO is in AL and doesn't already have Medication Set-up or Medication Administration as an a la carte service, then this won't be possible. Even if they aren't prescription. This is how it is for my MIL in LTC. Everything goes through the doctor/nursing staff and is documented.
(0)
Report
While I'm not a big fan of unregulated supplements, I do advocate for individual autonomy--PROVIDED the person is mentally competent. She needs to be able to understand that her choices can have seriously negative consequences. (The visitor needs to understand that as well.)

In this case I agree with others who have suggested a discussion with mom and her visitor about the potential dangers of unknown substances and mixing drugs. However, if she is competent, I think it is mom's decision to make, hopefully in conjunction with a medical professional. That said, perfect "safety" isn't always a thing for old people. Feeling better (or the perception of same) very well may be.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report
Irphueso Jan 13, 2024
My mom has dementia. And the person knows too. The only thing she says is that my mom is fine, (and she doesn't want to see the medical records)and because my mom asks her for that and that's why she gives all the capsules. For me is like a child, so we have to be careful about what she is asking
(0)
Report
You probably won’t convince the visitor that ‘natural supplements’ could be harmful. Perhaps you could say that M can’t remember instructions and is likely to take too many at once, which could be disastrous. If the overdose is fatal, which is always possible, there will be an inquirey, and visitor may be visited by the police to find out what she has supplied, how much, why and why haven’t the doctors approved it.

‘You could be in trouble’ is more likely to work than ‘stop it with your wonderful natural helpful pills’.
Helpful Answer (2)
Report
Irphueso Jan 13, 2024
I already told the person all that and he has continued to carry it out secretly. That's why I talked to the director because I need to stop that person from entering since he didn't listen to me that he should only be on medication, even if it is natural supplements. But I don't know what to do anymore
(1)
Report
Please tell us what a "nursing center" is.

Any meds or supplements would need to have an MD's orders. Is this a "care home"?
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Irphueso Jan 13, 2024
My mom is in Nursing center or convalescence
(0)
Report
Supplements ARE regulated as explained below by a supplement watchdog group. Perhaps a better question would be whether Mom was under the care of a naturopath before the nursing home. If so, that practitioner should know Mom's current prescription regimen and make recommendations accordingly.
Certainly a talk with Friend is warranted. As suggested, having one of the staff - perhaps the nursing manager - involved.

"The dietary supplement industry is regulated on a federal level in the U.S. by the Food and Drug Administration (FDA) and the Federal Trade Commission (FTC) as well as by government agencies in each of the 50 states. 

Nearly all facets of dietary supplement manufacturing, labeling and marketing are covered by extensive regulations issued and enforced by FDA and FTC.
The FDA has regulatory authority under the Federal Food, Drug and Cosmetic Act as amended in 1994 by the Dietary Supplement Health and Education Act (DSHEA) and in 2006 by the Dietary Supplement and Nonprescription Drug Consumer Protection Act. Under DSHEA, dietary supplements are regulated as a category of food. FDA regulates both finished dietary supplement products and dietary ingredients. By law, it is illegal to manufacture or market dietary supplement products that are adulterated or misbranded and FDA has regulatory authority to remove such products from the marketplace."
- Dietary supplements are regulated by FDA and FTC | Council for Responsible Nutrition (crnusa.org)
Helpful Answer (1)
Report
Geaton777 Jan 9, 2024
 ravensdottir, sorry but wishful thinking:

From the FDA's own website...

"In general, FDA is limited to postmarket enforcement because, unlike drugs that must be proven safe and effective for their intended use before marketing,  > > > there are no provisions in the law for FDA to approve dietary supplements for safety before they reach the consumer." < < <

Source: https://www.fda.gov/food/dietary-supplements#:~:text=FDA%20regulates%20both%20finished%20dietary,conventional%22%20foods%20and%20drug%20products.

Please understand that supplements are not required to prove effectiveness and safety.

"Caveat emptor" (Latin: "Buyer, beware!")
(7)
Report
When a health history is taken, a person is supposed to report all meds that are prescribed, plus any supplements that are taken.

I would be concerned about your mom too since supplements can interfere with prescription medications.

Even if there aren’t any interactions, some people go overboard with supplements.

Do you know why this person feels compelled to give your mother supplements? I would tell this friend that they need to stop giving her these supplements because they could potentially harm your mother.

Does your mom want to take the supplements? Does she even know what they are? Do you know? Can you somehow ask her doctor to intervene for you since the facility isn’t being helpful?

Wishing you and your family all the best.
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

I’m surprised that the director said that . Usually a doctor’s order is needed for all medications and supplements .

You said your father has POA. Has your father tried speaking to this friend ?
Or is your father ok with what is happening ?

Unfortunately since you do not have POA I don’t think there is much you can do .
Perhaps call APS , or Ombudsman ?
Your mother can not make decisions and is vulnerable because of this situation
Helpful Answer (0)
Report

This question has been closed for answers. Ask a New Question.
Ask a Question
Subscribe to
Our Newsletter